Why do people feel that in order to praise one game,

by **poetic chalice** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:51 am

they have to put down another?

I signed up on this forum specifically to say that it seems unfair how people feel the need to put down TOEE when they are reviewing this game.

First of all, it's incorrect and misleading to lump TOEE in the same group as Baldur's Gate and Neverwinter Nights. TOEE was/is a one of a kind D&D game on the PC with the co8 mods.

Second of all, the developer of this game liked TOEE and I'm sure used TOEE as an inspiration. So perhaps he can encourage people not to trash TOEE in their reviews.

TOEE is a game that got much lower reviews than it deserved because the game was rushed by the publisher and was released in an unfinished state. But the great guys at co8 have done much to show us the true potential of this wonderful game. Please don't give people the wrong impression of TOEE.

P.S. I should add that I really really enjoyed the demo of Knights of the Chalice, which stands great on its own merits.

by **VentilatorOfDoom** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:07 pm

Did someone diss ur favorite gaem? Where? Show me where did they trash ToEE, I'll teach them.

by **BlueSalamander** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 9:55 pm

I love TOEE, it's among my top five. Where is this review of Knights of the Chalice?

by **getter77** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 10:41 pm

Since I've not yet seen any actual full-on reviews for KoTC outside of general player ones, I THINK what it comes down to with is people making a case here and there of "finally the inherent ToEE bogged down stuff is gone"---as I think many people have issue with the pacing and difficulty levels in ToEE even with what Co8 has wrought thus far as there is still much to the game they've not yet cracked since they lack the proper code to majorly change.

by **screeg** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 1:39 am

Since I contributed custom backgrounds for the revised ToEE, and many more for the Keep On the Borderlands stand-alone expansion, I'll second what you're saying: people have been working on this game for five years post-release. Try it now, it's not the same game. The expansion is something like another 15-20 hours of gameplay, all new.

by **Darkion** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 6:27 am

I haven't seen any KotC reviews bashing Temple of Elemental Evil. So, where can it be found?

by **VentilatorOfDoom** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:25 am

screeg wrote:Since I contributed custom backgrounds for the revised ToEE, and many more for the Keep On the Borderlands stand-alone expansion, I'll second what you're saying: people have been working on this game for five years post-release. Try it now, it's not the same game. The expansion is something like another 15-20 hours of gameplay, all new.

I played ToEE more than once with the Co8 patch and while I'm sure the Co8 guys did a lot to improve the game, some things were not changed.
Constant crashes, and even worse: constant corrupted save games, especially in the new areas that were added by Co8 I had massive problems with corrupted savegames. What about the parts of the game that are incredibly boring to play through like Hommlet? What about the non-existing difficulty once you reach lvl5?
What about the fact that you have to reinstall completely before beginning a new game otherwise you might run into the secret door bug? ToEE is a buggy mess even today. There, I said it.

by **poetic chalice** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:42 am

I was reading through the comments on the "Links to comments and reviews" thread, and found random things like:

"In many ways I find it superior to Temple of Elemental Evil, the encounters feel a lot more fun and varied and there seems like a lot more to explore."

"I found KotC very easy to immediately pick up and play; as opposed to other indie RPGs like Jeff Vogel's Avernum 5 (which took quite a while for me to get used to), or even retail games like Temple of Elemental Evil with its rather awkward radial UI dial."

Maybe I got a bit too defensive of ToEE there and I made the comments to be worse than they are :oops:

by **Darthcast** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:15 pm

Never mind, I felt the same way when I read about my favorite RPGs on the main page.

by **Demiath** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:16 pm

The last quoted comment there was mine, and if it makes you feel any better I'll gladly add that I really, really enjoyed TOEE and also had no technical problems whatsoever during my one Co8-powered playthrough. When it comes to interfaces I prefer KotC's (regardless of font and even without BlueSalamander's latest improvements to the system) but as far as the actual gameplay is concerned I like both games equally.